TDs accuse Jim O'Callaghan of committing 'injustice to profession' of barristers in heated Oireachtas meeting

His Government colleague, Fine Gael TD and barrister Barry Ward, suggested that Mr O’Callaghan had demonstrated a “severe lack of understanding of how the courts work” by equating court adjournments with inefficiencies by the legal profession. Mr O’Callaghan is also a barrister.

From Wednesday, solicitors will be paid for free legal aid cases under a “one accused, one fee system”. While it was proposed that the flat fee would be €455 per case, this has been increased to €520.

The Law Society has said that solicitors will pull out of the free legal aid system, and that they “may very well choose to never come back”.

Mr O’Callaghan told the committee he could not “ignore that there are abuses going on in the system”.

Fine Gael TD Paula Butterly, who is a barrister, said she has “reservations” about the changes, arguing the changes “compromise the access of justice”.

I think you're doing a huge injustice to the profession. I think you're doing a huge injustice to the people that are trying to access the courts.

Mr O’Callaghan denied this assertion, arguing that his “sole focus is the public”.

He later told Sinn Féin TD Mark Ward that adjournments are “being too casually presented and too casually agreed”.

The minister added: “My view is that if you incentivise people by way of payment for every adjourned hearing date, you're going to get more adjourned hearing dates. That’s just natural.”

At one point during the meeting, Mr O’Callaghan objected to the public gallery in the committee room “shouting out abusive comments”.

However, nobody in the room could tell the Irish Examiner what the comments were, with one TD saying there was “mumbling”, and another suggesting there was “laughing”.

In a statement, the Law Society confirmed that it understood that “solicitors from across the country are resigning from criminal legal aid panels” from Wednesday due to the fee changes.

Its president Rosemarie Loftus told a second sitting of the Oireachtas Justice Committee that there could be an “exodus” by solicitors from the legal aid system.

“What is going to happen on the ground?” she asked.

“Will there be legal deserts, as there are with GP deserts? Legal deserts in rural Ireland?”

She said that the new system was “deeply concerning”.

The minister and the department have made the assumption that delays are caused by solicitors seeking to maximise fees.

“In reality, the overwhelming majority of adjournments are sought by the State to allow time for disclosure, DPP directions, forensic reports, etc.

“The department's desk-based review could never have captured the reasons for adjournments as they were not recorded.”

She also argued that the flat fee approach will “disproportionately harm vulnerable defendants”.

She called for the introduction of a flat fee to be postponed “until such time as the Department of Justice has received and processed all the additional data that it has been requested from the court service”.

Ms Loftus said that while the “abuses in the system have to be called out”, the examples being given by Mr O’Callaghan are “anecdotes”, and the Law Society has not been provided with the information.

Dr Shane McCarthy of the Law Society criticised comments made by Mr O’Callaghan that “young, ambitious” solicitors will be willing to accept free legal aid cases where others have withdrawn. “That, as an attitude, is appalling,” he said.

Following the justice committee, chairman Matt Carthy wrote to Mr O’Callaghan saying that the evidence that the Bar of Ireland and Law Society provided regarding engagement about the new fee structure “differs significantly from your own”.

He said the committee was seeking further clarification on his engagement with the groups.

“The committee has agreed to call on you to suspend the implementation of changes to the Criminal Legal Aid Scheme with immediate effect,” Mr Carthy said.

However, the Irish Examiner understands Mr O’Callaghan is “not for turning”.

• Louise Burne is Political Correspondent.