‘You miss out on a medal but it’s not going to pay your bills.’
John Fogarty: How do you know each other?
Kevin Cassidy: “The same as any other Gaelic player would know one another but Donegal and Mayo would play a lot of friendlies. There would have been underage as well. Before you actually talk to the person, you feel you kinda know them from the field.”
John Fogarty: No run- ins or anything like that?
Conor Mortimer: “No, I think it was more when you (Cassidy) were in college in Sligo. We had a lot of mutual friends. It’s rare on a pitch where you’ll get it but you know when you’ll click with somebody and you know when you won’t.”
John Fogarty: There are mixed reports of relations between the two camps. How do you see it?
Kevin Cassidy: “I would feel there has been quite a good relationship. I would know the likes of (Michael) Moylesy and them kinda boys from Sligo IT. I think Mayo and Donegal people are kinda similar.
Conor Mortimer: “Yeah, I lived in the same house as (Michael) Murphy and (Martin) McElhinney and young Deccie Walsh and (Michael) Boyler. Great skins, good craic. They enjoy their lives as well as take their football seriously.”
John Fogarty: The obvious question — how strange has this week been for you?
Conor Mortimer: “We were just talking about it between ourselves, we’re alright with it.”
Kevin Cassidy: “Definitely. When you’re playing, Jesus, you want to be in an All-Ireland final but once you’re outside, you see the other things in life. I know that might be hard for people to believe this week and people look at you and think, ‘Ah, he’s only giving me what I want to hear.’ Yes, an All-Ireland medal would be brilliant but at the end of the day, what is it when you go back home December, January and February? You’re back to your normal life. That’s the way I would feel about it.”
Conor Mortimer: “It doesn’t pay the bills, at the end of the day.”
John Fogarty: Conor, you’ve a fiancée and Kevin has a wife and twin toddlers. Did taking that step make things easier for you regarding the football?
Conor Mortimer: “If I lived at home (in Mayo) and wasn’t travelling up and down I might still be playing. All these things come to you after. Hindsight. As Cass said, they mightn’t believe you but it’s irrelevant whether they believe you or not. You know what’s going on in your own life and that’s ultimately the way it is. People only see you on a pitch or read your name in a paper. Nobody knows what’s going on in your own life.”
John Fogarty: Considering your friendship, were you in touch with another when you left your county panels?
Conor Mortimer: “I knew what it was about and the issues but I found out more when I talked to him while he was in America during the summer. In one way, it’s different that Cass was coming off the back of a big year whereas I was coming back from injury. You read things differently in your own emotions. You put up with a lot more stuff when you’re younger. If things aren’t 50-50, then effectively there’s no point banging your head against a wall.”
Kevin Cassidy: “I texted him and chatted to him. I’m not saying this because Conor is here but the downside of the GAA is a lot of people forget what players actually do. I know Mort down through the years playing for Mayo was dragging them through in the darker days. I don’t think people should forget about what they have done. I would have felt for Conor as a person. I didn’t know what the fallout was but just as a human being if it’s not working out I don’t think people should be downing anybody or saying he didn’t do this or he didn’t do that.”
John Fogarty: I’ll ask you what was the worst thing said or written to you after what happened but firstly what was the message you most appreciated?
Kevin Cassidy: “When I left and it causing such the big deal that it did, although I wouldn’t have been getting a lot of contact from people on the team, I would have acknowledged people outside Donegal who had nothing to do with the situation at all or had anything to do with me sending messages. They were nice gestures. People you wanted the messages to come from, no messages came at all.”
Conor Mortimer: “No more than Cass’s situation, people would have sat back and thought about a person’s life as such. You get a lot of negative stuff. People think it’s all doom and gloom for you and you’re the worst person in the world but it’s the same in any walk of life. You make a decision and if you think it’s right, that’s what you have to do.”
John Fogarty: So what is the worst thing that has been said to you?
Kevin Cassidy: “I haven’t heard anything too bad. You get the odd sly comment if you’re out somewhere, not so much that you let them down but they’re laughing at you because Donegal are doing well and “we don’t need you”. That kinda thing. You take that with a pinch of salt. It’s the people who are close to you that matter most.”
Conor Mortimer: “Much the same, I think it’s easy for someone to say over the internet or four or five people around them in a bar. It’s an easy way of talking to somebody. I’ll probably be saying it for the rest of my life but your friends and the people closest to you will row in behind you regardless of what you do, whether it’s right or wrong. If you say something to someone or get sent off in a match, it’s the same. You have to row by it. I go home to my fiancée, Cass goes home to his wife and kids. They’re the people you see every single day and they’re not going to be criticising you.”
John Fogarty: It’s been said, Kevin, that when you contributed to the This Is Our Year book you wrote your death warrant as a Donegal player. Did you look at it that way?
Kevin Cassidy: “Me and Jim has this conversation back in Easter time. We sat down and he said “obviously, there’s stuff you’re annoyed about and there’s stuff I’m annoyed about”. So he started off and said our code of conduct stated nobody was allowed to talk about this or that. ‘Why didn’t you come to me?’ he said. A lot of people said I was incredibly naive. Obviously, I knew I was telling (author) Declan Bogue stuff that was happening in the camp. But the way I explained it to Jim McGuinness was that we played Tyrone but we (Cassidy and Bogue) met after the game so there was no chance for Declan to tell him what happened. Being honest, I didn’t really know Declan Bogue. It was just somebody came and asked could I help him and I said ‘no bother, I’ll give a hand’. So there was no opportunity for him to go and tell secrets. There were no secrets that came out anyway — it was only stuff that people knew and had already spoken about. If I did what Jimmy McGuinness was saying, the whole country would know how Donegal operate because we were all given an actual sheet — I have it in the house somewhere — of how we would play. If I was that bad a guy or if that was what I wanted to do, that would be in the book. It wasn’t. I said to him that the stuff I was telling was stuff that people had seen. Open training sessions, like. Joe Brolly and these guys had been to our training sessions. They knew exactly who was there. I didn’t think I let him down.”
John Fogarty: So it was a clear-the-air meeting?
Kevin Cassidy: “Aye, he approached me at Easter time, we sat down and we had a conversation. Obviously, there were things he was pissed off about and there were things I was pissed off about. The launch of the book that he banned people from going near. I thought that was bad form, on a human basis. Stuff like team holidays and telling our family couldn’t go on that. The opportunity was there to go back but I said to him I didn’t want to go back and bring a whole media circus with me because these boys were about to go into their Championship season. It wouldn’t have been fair on the panel or my family. I don’t hold any grudges, I’ve never fallen out with anybody (about it) and I never will but you learn as you go on.”
John Fogarty: Jim made you an offer to return to the panel?
Kevin Cassidy: “He came to my school after work one day. It was a very civilised conversation, there were no heated moments. He said what he had to say and I said what I had to say because on top of that, and I’m sure Mort is the same, a lot of people said to me that ‘Jim McGuinness was saying this about you’. It was the same for Jim and none of it was true at all and there were a lot of crossed wires. It was good to clear that up, we left and we shook hands. I was heading on holidays the following week, the opportunity was there to go back but I sent a text from holidays that I wouldn’t be going back. I felt it wouldn’t be fair on the team or on me or my family.”
John Fogarty: Were you compensated for not being invited on the team holiday?
Kevin Cassidy: “Yeah, in fairness they looked after us with a voucher. I wouldn’t have been happy with how I was dealt with but that’s for another day.”
John Fogarty: Any approach made to you, Conor, to convince you back?
Conor Mortimer: “They were moving onto the quarter-finals and had more to worry about. I didn’t expect to hear anything, to be honest. You make these decisions and you have to live with them.”
John Fogarty: You both have close friends on the panels but there were some cold shoulders directed your ways. Did that disappointment you?
Conor Mortimer: “When you know people for a long time and the friendship builds up over years of playing, the respect grows and that should be adhered to. As a players’ rule, it should be adhered to all the time. In relation to cold shoulders, on one side players are only looking after themselves and they’re looking after the panel they’re involved in. I can understand why people wouldn’t want to step on someone’s toes. Thirty people saying something is always better than one.”
Kevin Cassidy: “I don’t think it’s the right time to be talking about that. There is a big game coming up and that’s the most important thing.”
John Fogarty: What about the fallout from your decision?
Conor Mortimer: “I rang Jimmy (Horan). Obviously, I had a few problems and I wasn’t happy with a few things. Down the phone, he wanted to meet up and stuff and not to do what I was doing but I was adamant at the time. Anything that happened after that was out of my doing. That’s all I did. We had a conversation over the phone and that was it. People build things up and make them into bigger things. A lot of players have left teams over the years. Because you have the scoring record, people make mountains out of molehills but you can only be knocking on the door for so long and if you’re wasting your time you have to make a call somewhere along the line. I’ve always said I’m not very particular about sitting on a bench. If I had been playing poorly I’d have said “yeah, fine” but when you’re not or you don’t think you are... you’re always going to think you’re playing well. That’s the way it was.”
John Fogarty: Conor, you didn’t know about your family statement on your exit. Did it exacerbate the fallout?
Conor Mortimer: “I presume people will say that, but I can understand a family’s looking on it. In hindsight, maybe if they didn’t what would the case be? Look, it’s the same as my own decision — you do something and that’s it. No matter who said it or what was said, you always appreciate support from your family. That’s all they were doing for me.”
John Fogarty: How difficult were things for your family, Kevin?
Kevin Cassidy: “Your family will always back you. A lot of people see that Conor Mortimer plays for Mayo and Kevin Cassidy plays for Donegal but they don’t see the work that goes on behind the scenes to do that. The birthdays you miss, the weddings you miss, the holidays you miss. They (the family) saw all the sacrifices. When it happened they stood fully behind me. Even to this day, because Donegal are in an All-Ireland, it’s affecting them. When I came back (from Boston this summer), I think it’s been hurting them more than it’s hurting me. When I got back from America, I’d the chance to go up to my mother and sit down and talk to her and say, ‘Listen, it doesn’t really bother me so the rest of ye should move on.’ Hopefully, Donegal win, everybody will be happy and we can all go back to our normal lives on Monday or Tuesday.”
John Fogarty: Is there some consolation for the pair of you that you have achieved more than most in your careers?
Kevin Cassidy: “That’s the way I feel. You talk about your All-Irelands and your Ulsters or Connachts but at the end of the day it’s only a circle of a medal. I’d appreciate more the people I have met. I wouldn’t have known Conor Mortimer or anybody if I wasn’t involved in GAA. It’s shaped me as a character. If I wasn’t involved in the GAA, I don’t think I’d be the person I am today.”
Conor Mortimer: “Like Kevin says, there is no substitute for real friends that you met. A couple of years ago when my grandfather died, guys who I’d met in college came down to the funeral from Dublin and Monaghan. It’s fair to say that the majority of the people who give you stick, 90% of them have never played for their county in any game. Winning Connacht titles, an All Star, playing in a couple of All-Ireland finals, playing for Mayo since I was 16 or 17, I’d be happy enough with the length of time I’ve played and only missing last year through injury. Obviously, you miss out on a medal but it’s not going to pay your bills. The older you get the more you realise that. I was playing for 10 years and then sitting at home for six months last year not working and literally didn’t have a bob to go out and meet the lads on a Saturday night. You can’t ring somebody and say, ‘I play football for so and so’ and expect to be working. Maybe a few years ago that was different but nowadays you need to go to college and get qualifications. I’d be content enough.”
John Fogarty: Despite your current situations, you both seem to have a lot of respect for Jim McGuinness and James Horan as managers. Would you rate them as the best you have played under?
Kevin Cassidy: “I’ve massive respect for Jim McGuinness and what he’s done coaching the Donegal team and where we are right now. He’s probably the best that I’ve ever worked under. I think he’s going to set the trend for coaching over the next five to 10 years. In that text I sent from holiday, I thanked him for what he done for me personally and would definitely have a great appreciation of him.”
Conor Mortimer: “I played with Jimmy (Horan) and never had a problem with him. A good player, a good team-mate. Coming into management, the way he set up his people around him. He’s the best of the best. Ed Coughlan in sports science, Liam Moffatt his physio, Cian O’Neill the trainer, James Nallen, Tom Prendergast... all these guys are big names in their areas and it wasn’t easy to get them, especially Cian O’Neill from Tipperary last year. I think the organisation of the whole thing has been top class, in fairness. I’d a lot of time for all my managers. A lot of people said I didn’t get on with (John) O’Mahony but I got texts from him when I got engaged or when I’ve won something. I’ve respect for all my managers. I’ve trained and worked hard under them all but look, you can have differences of opinions and something has to give. There’s no point in sitting in a place and being unhappy for five or six months.”
John Fogarty: Can you ever see yourselves wearing a county jersey or colours in the stand?
Kevin Cassidy: “I’ve never worn a Donegal jersey watching a game or seen an ex-player wear one. I don’t know who set the trend but I don’t think we’ll buck it.”
Conor Mortimer: “No, you’d always go (to games) but it’s alright for young people to wear jerseys because they’re with their parents and going home. Generally, when I’m going to a match it tends to turn into an evening and a night kind of thing.”
John Fogarty: How do you see the final going?
Conor Mortimer: “Donegal are favourites, they’ve had the tougher run-in but that tag means zip when it comes to the big time. Mayo have a great chance of winning but they need to play well above what they’ve played all year. They won’t have met a team like Donegal with the intensity and the ferocity that they have, the way they smother teams and frustrate teams into playing. I think they need to stop McFadden and Lacey in particular. They’re two of their really key players. McBrearty mightn’t score an awful lot but gets on a lot of ball and causes problems. Last but not least, Mark McHugh. He’s been a big player all year. I don’t know what their bench is like. They’ve only had one or two changes and they’re usually the same changes in each game. If both teams play to their potential, it’s hard to look past Donegal but if Mayo are in it with 10 minutes to go, they could sneak it.”
Kevin Cassidy: “The way Donegal have steamrolled through this season, I find it very hard to come up with a way how Mayo are going to cause them problems. The hype has gone crazy at home, as Conor said, but Jim will have that under control. It will be all about this game and all about this performance. The word “All-Ireland”, I’d be surprised if it’s even mentioned. I just think after going through Cork, Kerry, Tyrone etc Donegal don’t want to now let it slip. As long as Mayo don’t sneak an early goal or an early couple of scores because, as Conor says, I don’t think we have anyone on the bench who can come in and change the game. We have the structure but if it’s put to us that’s where there might be a problem. I can’t see Mayo having the space to do that.”
