Brian and Arthur's surrogacy journey: 'People see how loud and proud we are'

Brian Dowling and Arthur Gourounlian charted their surrogacy journey from start to finish for a new RTÉ documentary. They talk parenthood with Mary Cate Smith

Brian Dowling Gourounlian, Arthur Gourounlian, and their daughter Blake. Pic: Nina Val

“It was the most natural thing in the world.” 

Brian Dowling Gourounlian is talking about holding his daughter Blake for the very first time. For his partner, Arthur Gourounlian, those first few moments with Blake were almost bittersweet.

“I was in tears. I was crying so much that it was all a blur. You’ve always got doubts in your head because you’ve jumped through all these hoops together and suddenly you have this human in your hands. It was just incredible.”

The Kildare-based couple started shooting the documentary in June last year, charting their surrogacy journey from start to finish. In December 2022, the Irish Government approved policy proposals recognising past and present surrogacy arrangements carried out abroad. While Brian and Arthur are quick to point out that neither of them are experts on the subject, they wanted the documentary to be an honest depiction of the ups and downs they faced.

“Blake was a week or two old and we stopped taping because the legislation was changing and we wanted to make it current,” says Brian.

“It’s our story but we wanted to make sure we were telling it through the legislation point of view,” adds Arthur.

When Brian reflects back on the day Blake was born, the happy memories are still tinged with fear. “I just remember being quite nervous. I asked one of the nurses if it was okay to hold her. I kept thinking someone was going to try and take her. It wasn’t till we got home on September 2 that I was properly able to relax.”

It was so important for Brian to have his sister Aoife’s voice represented in this documentary.

“Aoife is considered Blake’s biological mother. She’s obviously not and I feel like that’s something I have to keep repeating quite a lot. In the eyes of the Irish law, they allow her to change her mind at any point.”

While the couple remain tight-lipped about whether they were in the delivery room with Aoife, they do say the birth was a “team effort” but we have to watch the show to find out.

“We were adamant in getting Aoife’s consent — what she was comfortable with and what the hospital allowed,” says Brian.

“It was the priority that whatever she was happy with, we will do it,” says Arthur.

HARMFUL NARRATIVES

Brian and Arthur: "We’ve been called traffickers. I’ve been called a womb rapist. We’ve been compared to the Magdalene Laundries — that’s really hardcore."

Brian and Arthur went to a clinic in Europe to select an egg donor. The process was rigorous, says Brian, something which eased any fears he had about potential complications during the pregnancy.

“We had loads of Zooms with the embryologist there; health is obviously very important. They go above and beyond — looking into their ancestors — you find out who smoked, exercise, education. We had the crème de la crème.”

Arthur admits he knew next to nothing about surrogacy before engaging with the process: “Initially, my dream — my everything — was to have a child. I didn’t want to spend money, I didn’t even know where to start.”

They were “blessed” to have Aoife, Brian says, and hopes that the harmful narrative people are peddling about her being a victim will stop when they hear from her in the documentary.

For both men, it was also important to understand why their egg donor was doing this.

“We’ve never seen a picture of Blake’s donor,” says Brian.

“We just get a serial number, we don’t even see what she looked like as a child. This total stranger has gifted us Blake and without them none of this would be possible. It’s something that’s still quite taboo but we were reassured [by the embryologist] because they know so much about the donors.”

Arthur wanted this documentary to be as transparent as possible so other couples could understand the process but also to show that they are just like any other couple, making a family based on love and mutual respect.

“When we announced that we were pregnant, obviously all this mess just came through. It was horrible. But then it kind of calmed down because they realised, wait a minute, you’re not forcing anybody somewhere in Eastern Europe to do this.”

Brian believes that homophobia has fuelled a lot of the vitriol he and Arthur have received.

“We’ve been called traffickers. I’ve been called a womb rapist. We’ve been compared to the Magdalene Laundries — that’s really hardcore. It’s aggressive and libelous too — people are saying the most ridiculous things.

“It’s very odd that people want to paint the donor and the surrogate as victims. My sister and our egg donor are not victims. They were very adamant on what they were doing and why they wanted to do it.”

Brian jokes that Aoife was a “diva” when in fact, she was quite the opposite. “Too posh to push,” Arthur bursts out laughing. “Ah, nooooo….” “She demanded a c-section,” adds Brian, teasing.

“She’s 33, she’s single. I’m sure she wanted to make sure everything was still intact. And I said ‘ah, go on sure’.”

All joking aside, Arthur admits that the constant scrutiny online did really start to wear thin.

“It did get to me a bit. When people say ‘he’s disgusting, he shouldn’t be allowed to be a parent’. I know plenty of people with a mother and a father and that is not why they are loved.”

While Brian and Arthur’s social media is a fun space for dancing and shenanigans, this documentary goes a little bit further than that, explains Brian.

“It lifts the filter. We wanted to get that conversation started but also help other couples going through this.”

'IF WE CAN HELP ONE FAMILY, OUR JOB IS DONE'

"There are so many kids to adopt in Ireland, which is absolutely fantastic. But at the same time, being gay and the age we are, we were straightaway shut down"

As a young gay man, Arthur had always thought he would adopt.

“My dream was to adopt three boys. I knew since day one that I wanted a family. But when I was dating Brian, he would be like ‘yeah, yeah, maybe when we’re older’. He would be quite blasé about it. But then obviously we got married. It was his choice — I had to propose to him.”

The men were living in LA and began to look into adoption but when covid-19 hit, they decided to move back to Ireland. Arthur started to feel disheartened when time and time again, the adoption process didn’t work out for them.

“There are so many kids to adopt in Ireland, which is absolutely fantastic. But at the same time, being gay and the age we are [Arthur is 42 and Brian is 45] we were straightaway shut down. When we said we were gay, the phone calls stopped.” Arthur hopes that the documentary will help others on a similar journey.

“I’ve been learning so much about surrogacy and lots of people said, ‘thanks to your story, I’m going to do this’. If we can help one family, my job is done.”

As far as fatherhood goes, Brian is constantly surprised by how well he can function on so little sleep but acknowledges that Blake’s sleep routine contributes to that.

“We were very lucky. She only ever has one night feed. We feed her at 10/11pm, she’d go through to 4am and then again to 8am.

“It amazes me how quickly they grow. She recognises our voices. Now, when she ‘makes strange’, she turns to her papa or her daddy.” Arthur can hardly remember life before Blake, a life that included dancing with Beyoncé, Pink, and Kylie Minogue and choreographing for some of the top pop acts around the world.

“When I looked after my nephew and he was crying, I just gave him to my sister. Now, I love that moment and when they cry, you pick them up in your arms and they just love you. I was like ‘oh my god, this is what I’ve been waiting for all my life’.”

Both parents are known for their style credentials but Blake has proven herself to be quite the showstopper on social media. Arthur loves “matchy matchy” while Brian likes an element of “clashy clashy”. “She serves up a lot of looks,” says Brian. “She likes the attention.” Arthur swears she likes mixing up her outfits, sometimes multiple times in a day.

“She never cries when we change her. It’s like she’s waiting to be changed,” he laughs.

'SHE'S GOT 'SIDE EYE''

Brian Dowling (left): “I picked up dog s**t for a living, I worked in a takeaway, at Ryanair, I then went onto Big Brother. There’s one thing she’ll never do — reality TV.”

In the nature vs nurture debate, both parents see their mannerisms emerging in Blake. Brian has noticed one facial expression in particular that almost makes him squeal as he recalls it.

“She’s got ‘side eye’ when she wants something and she’s determined to get it. She is very vocal. She has a really fun personality.” Arthur claims he is leaning into the ‘Stage Mom’ persona.

“She loves singing and dancing. You know, she really is the best version of the both of us.”

“I’d love her to do something studious. Maybe a plastic surgeon,” says Brian.

“I picked up dog s**t for a living, I worked in a takeaway, at Ryanair, I then went onto Big Brother. There’s one thing she’ll never do — reality TV.”

Brian and Arthur’s dream when it comes to changing legislation is to be recognised as Blake’s parents on her birth certificate. Only one of them was going to be the biological father and both parties knew and accepted that before embarking on this journey.

“Everyone was obsessed with biology and DNA,” says Brian.

“People see how loud we are and how proud we are and they think ‘there’s nothing wrong with this.’ It is possible,” Arthur says.

• Brian and Arthur’s Very Modern Family airs Monday March 13 at 9.35pm on RTÉ One and RTÉ Player. 
• Photos shot on location at Barberstown Castle, a four-star 58-bedroom country house hotel & historic 13th century castle.