Kathleen Lynch: ‘I think Labour probably needs a different leader now’
A: “I’m a great believer in dealing with reality, I’ve done that all my life. I ran under a bus when I was 10 and I could have sat back and said, ‘I have a disability now so this is it, this is my life and this is it for me’.”
A: “Hugely injured, that’s why I still pop in and out of hospital every now and again.”
A: “Anti-D? No. Not that, not that at all. Even though Anti-D didn’t help.
“I was 10 when I ran under a double-decker bus in Blackpool. I was coming home from school and I spent the next seven years in hospital... I suppose the first four years continuously... They took everything off one of my legs, left me with a bone. That’s why I’m always fascinated by people who overcome great odds. I think it takes a particular mindset to do it. I had to learn how to walk about three times.”
A: “Absolutely, very disappointed. I mean you wouldn’t be normal not to be disappointed and especially when you’ve put in so much work.”
A: “There was no comparison. When it happened in 1997, it was unexpected, completely unexpected. At least we were half prepared this time. Of course, we thought we were still going to do it — always up to the final close of poll you feel you’re going to do it.
“But you get on with it, because when I lost my seat in ‘97, two years later my mother died and that puts it right back into focus. I thought that was the worst thing that ever happened to me until my mother died. And that was a much bigger event.”
A: “We thought saving the country was going to be the issue. I think we relied too much on the Clinton thing, you know, ‘it’s the economy stupid’, when in fact it was the day-to-day stuff. People didn’t see the improvement in their day-to-day lives despite the amount of people who are back at work.
“I think water was a big issue but I think that was only a catalyst for an awful lot of other things.”
A: “I think it’s quite likely that we’re going to have another election very soon, and in that event, I don’t think I’ll have an option. I think as well, I’m always a great believer in choice and I do believe that the people deserve to have a choice.
“Cork is left without any female representation — I think that choice needs to be there. And I think the Labour Party has to be part and parcel of any platform that’s there because I think we have something to offer.”
A: “Not as weird as when you’re elected for the first time which I think is probably the most daunting thing because you don’t even know where the toilets are.
“I suppose I’ve been through it slightly once before, even in this position, because I was the only one to survive the reshuffle two and a half years ago. And at that time for about almost two weeks myself and Adrian, private secretary at the Department of Health, used to look out the door every morning and say ‘Jesus, it’s like the Mary Celeste’.”
A: “It’s the first time in my lifetime that I have seen people so reluctant to go into government. It’s the programme for government you work on, nothing else. You don’t have to love one another, you just have to work on the programme for government. And they [Fianna Fáil] won this election and it is their job to form a government.
“And this business of its being about reform and ideas — it isn’t. It’s about positioning for the next election. That’s what it’s about. Nothing else.”
A: “Then it comes back to — what do you do if she does?”
A: “There’s no shortage of takers. I think Brendan Howlin would be an exceptional leader. I think Seán Sherlock — we have to have a leader and a deputy. Seán Sherlock is very solid, very focused.
A: “Ah yes. But if the leader steps down, then surely it’s incumbent on the deputy to vacate and maybe put himself forward for a different position?”
A: “For example, party leader. As I say, there’s never a shortage of takers.”
A: “Brendan Howlin. I think Alan was a good deputy leader in the circumstances but I think Brendan would be a better leader.”
A: “I’m not certain that he has the experience to be a good leader.
“Now I always believe as well of course that the people we least expect to perform best usually do perform best and the people we have very high expectations of can’t possibly live up to them.”
A: “In the event that I was re-elected — I would certainly sit and say ‘What exactly can I bring to that table?’ I would be interested. But I would be realistic enough, I hope I would be realistic enough to recognise maybe greater ability in somebody else.”
A: “I think Joan did very well in Social Protection. I thought that she was a good leader at that particular time. I think we probably need a different leader now.”
A: “It wasn’t Alan Shatter, he was actually very easy to work with and myself and Alan got on very, very well. And he was the most progressive... And I do think sometimes people sort of fix on him as being the most difficult and actually he wasn’t.”
A: “I prefer not to say.”
A: “James Reilly was actually quite easy to deal with... he would give you credit — there was that kind of inert decency about him.”
A: “Compared to other ministers for health who are so obsessed with publicity.”
A: “Compared to other ministers for health.”
A: “I think we can often be blinded by the visual.
“He’s a very good communicator, he’s an excellent communicator. He has a vision for the health service, he really has a vision for the health service, I’m just saying in comparison with James Reilly, James was far more likely to give you credit for all you had done. That’s really all that I’m saying.”
A: “I found James very easy to deal with. I suppose recognising that you are not the minister for health is very important. He has overall responsibility — you have responsibility for your section.
“I suppose if you’re a minister of state in any department, the first thing you have to know is that you are not the minister. Some people never get that.”
A: “Or wanted to be.”
A: “I could actually... But I think Frances Fitzgerald will get it... I think she’s less overtly grabbing about it. I think she’s stable. To a great extent she exudes the kind of confidence Angela Merkel exudes.”
A: “I think she probably would.”
A: “He had an enormous grasp of detail which always surprised me. You would sit down and go through your papers before you went in [to meet him for a twice-monthly briefing] but he would ask you about something and you would think ‘How could he possibly know about that?’.
A: To a great extent he was a very steadying figure in times of great crisis, and there were enormous crises. And he doesn’t sell himself well... It’s not as if he doesn’t have a personality, he does.”
A: “Trevor Casey, that whole thing coming down on top of my head and on top of people around me who cared for me as well and they were very distressed.” (Kathleen wrote a reference on behalf of the parents of Trevor Casey which was read out in court by the judge at Casey’s sentencing hearing when he was jailed for 14 years for the rape of two sisters when they were in their early teens.)
“Do I regret writing that letter? Yes, I do. If I had my time over again would I have written it? No I wouldn’t. I would have changed my mind because of the odium it placed on his family. And because at the end of the day you shouldn’t interfere in any process that’s before the courts.”
A: “My husband has always been my adviser and has always worked for me all his life, he just happens to be paid for it now. But for most of my political career he had done all of the work for me without being paid.
“Did I think it was the right thing to do? Yes, he knows the job, he knows it very well, he runs the office, he runs it very efficiently, works longer hours than anyone else.”
A: “Think about it for a minute. Just towards the end of last year, we rolled out on the southside of Cork City a community mental health team. We have one on the northside of the city, it works extremely well, 24/7. And now we have one on the southside. That team is at least 14 people. And who pays for them? Where does that money come from?
“The new acute mental health unit in Cork University Hospital — in order to open that, the revenue costs, we had to put extra staff in... So that all comes out of the €35m. Perinatal developments, the new beds in the Child and Adolescent Mental Health Services (CAMHS)...”
A: “Yes.”
A: “If someone said to me ‘What are the values that you hold dearest?’, I would count loyalty as one of those and yes, I would have put someone like Catherine Clancy in, someone that you know is going to work for the party, someone that you know is going to have the same values as you have. And I’m not saying Máiría Cahill doesn’t.
A: “I have no idea.”
A: “No, I wouldn’t. Firstly, I think it’s probably the most gruelling campaign that you could put yourself through. And secondly, I think that the electorate in the Seanad is too narrow, the focus is too narrow, I’ve always believed that.
“I do think that the franchise has to be broadened. It’s elite.”
A: “Look, you have to know when to go, don’t you? And there’s some people who just have a bigger ego than others. And I mean I like him. I worked with him. And he’s very bright and he’s very intelligent and he has a lot to offer. But like, time to go.”
A: “I wouldn’t encourage any of them to go into politics... I think that politics has changed and I think that those around you are probably more hurt than you are about the things people say about you.
“And I wouldn’t like my children to be subjected to the kind of abuse that you now see on a daily basis from people who feel that they can say whatever they like because there are no consequences... these keyboard warriors they can say whatever they like, press send, and then no consequences.”
In her own words
“I think it’s quite likely that we’re going to have another election very soon, and in that event, I don’t think I’ll have an option.”
“I think we probably need a different leader now.”
“I think Brendan Howlin would be an exceptional leader.”
“I’m not certain that he has the experience to be a good leader.”
“I would be interested. But I would be realistic enough. I hope I would be realistic enough to recognise maybe greater ability in somebody else.”
“It wasn’t Alan Shatter. He was actually very easy to work with... And he was the most progressive.”
“James Reilly was actually quite easy to deal with. He would give you credit. There was that sort of inert decency about him compared to other ministers for health who are so obsessed with publicity.”
“I think we can often be blinded by the visual. He’s a very good communicator, he’s an excellent communicator.”
“If you’re a minister of state in any department, the first thing you have to know is that you are not the minister. Some people never get that.”
“He was a very steadying figure in times of great crisis, and there were enormous crises. And he doesn’t sell himself well. It’s not as if he doesn’t have a personality. He does.”
“I think Frances Fitzgerald will get it. I think she’s less overtly grabbing about it. I think she’s stable. To a great extent she exudes the kind of confidence Angela Merkel exudes.”
“I have no idea.”
“There are some people who just have a bigger ego than others. And I mean I like him. I worked with him. And he’s very bright and he’s very intelligent and he has a lot to offer. But like, time to go.”
